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PBA in local amateur events
  #1  
Old 03-30-2017, 02:23 PM
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PBA in local amateur events

Am I alone in saying amateur bowlers shouldn't have to go against someone holding a PBA card? I feel if you are that well practiced I shouldn't see you at the local match games beating up on the little guys. Right now we have a PBA card holder taking 7 wins this season. Just don't see this as a fair cut.

Re: PBA in local amateur events
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Old 03-30-2017, 02:45 PM
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Re: PBA in local amateur events

They have to bowl somewhere when they are not bowling in regionals or national events.

Now, is it ethically responsible for a PBA member to bowl in a local amateur event? That's a whole other issue. In some cases it may be, in others it may not be, depending on the situation.

Unless the local tournament rules state that no current PBA members may participate, then it is just something that can possibly happen. I had it happen in a local no-tap doubles tournament. Why a regional PBA bowler entered a no-tap tournament using a THS is beyond me, but they did [and they won first place]. Goes back to the ethical perspective of the issue.

There are lots of PBA card holders. It doesn't necessarily mean they are the cream of the crop. If you are talking about a PBA member that is well-known and makes their living from bowling, then that could be frustrating.
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Re: PBA in local amateur events
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Old 03-30-2017, 02:56 PM
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Re: PBA in local amateur events

Without a real PBA tour, these folks will continue to bottom feed off these tournaments.

I can't say I blame them, the PBA doesn't pay squat. Last year, E.J. Tackett was the leading money winner in the PBA with $168,290.

Source: https://www.pba.com/SeasonStats/TotalWinnings/93

I make more than that in my job. How many other "professional" sports can we say that about?

Re: PBA in local amateur events
  #4  
Old 03-31-2017, 01:48 AM
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Re: PBA in local amateur events

Maybe I'm the odd man out in that I bowl tournaments to test myself, not to make money (not that I mind when I do). From that perspective, I LOVE going up against PBA pros in tournaments.

As for ethics, the tournament director has every right to disallow PBA members, spread them out across teams, or whatever, as long as it's written in the tournament rules. If they're allowed to compete, I see nothing ethically wrong with doing so.

Re: PBA in local amateur events
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Old 03-31-2017, 08:33 AM
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Re: PBA in local amateur events

If its not fair for Pba card holders to bowl against the amatuers, What about the professional amatuers?

The bowlers who are obviously good enough to hold a Pba card, but don't so they can bowl in all the amatuer tournaments.

Where do you draw the line? Who is too good to be allowed to bowl?

Re: PBA in local amateur events
  #6  
Old 03-31-2017, 08:59 AM
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Re: PBA in local amateur events

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bahshay View Post
Maybe I'm the odd man out in that I bowl tournaments to test myself, not to make money (not that I mind when I do). From that perspective, I LOVE going up against PBA pros in tournaments.

As for ethics, the tournament director has every right to disallow PBA members, spread them out across teams, or whatever, as long as it's written in the tournament rules. If they're allowed to compete, I see nothing ethically wrong with doing so.
It depends on the situation. If I am a PBA card holder who has won a few regionals or even a national tournament, I would not consider it ethical to enter the local no-tap house shot tournament to beat up on other bowlers out to have fun in the hopes of winning $150-$200.

If it is a scratch sport shot tournament, or 700 club tournament, or other such event then it would be appropriate for a pro to enter since he/she will most likely be in a field of higher caliber competitive bowlers.

If the tournament rules allow PBA members to enter, then they are certainly eligible. Part of being a card carrying professional in any sport is also knowing when it is ethically appropriate to participate. Sometimes you have to exclude yourself from competing, especially for money, if you know going in you have an unfair advantage over the other participants (such as bowling a no-tap house shot tournament at a local center.) If bowling a charity event or fund raiser, by all means enter as it puts the PBA as a whole in a good light.

It is all about making the right choices when you reach professional level.
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Re: PBA in local amateur events
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Old 03-31-2017, 10:15 AM
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Re: PBA in local amateur events

Just because someone has card doesn't say much. The requirements to obtain a PBA card are not that high. You either lace them up and go or you don't enter. The onus is on you not the other bowler.

Re: PBA in local amateur events
  #8  
Old 03-31-2017, 10:43 AM
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Re: PBA in local amateur events

Quote:
Originally Posted by danielchaplin View Post
Am I alone in saying amateur bowlers shouldn't have to go against someone holding a PBA card? I feel if you are that well practiced I shouldn't see you at the local match games beating up on the little guys. Right now we have a PBA card holder taking 7 wins this season. Just don't see this as a fair cut.
From the look of these replies, I wouldn't say you're alone, but you do seem to be in the greater minority.

If you don't want to bowl against card holding PBA members, then don't enter events they are allowed into.

Re: PBA in local amateur events
  #9  
Old 03-31-2017, 10:49 AM
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Re: PBA in local amateur events

In golf, I believe, in order to compete in an amateur tournament, a PGA player would not be allowed to play until they had given up their card for two years. Not a bad rule.

In our area, there are a couple of bowling tournaments where some pretty good current pro players are starting to appear. Only time will tell if their presence will have a positive or negative effect on participation.

Re: PBA in local amateur events
  #10  
Old 03-31-2017, 10:59 AM
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Re: PBA in local amateur events

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gazoo View Post
Just because someone has card doesn't say much. The requirements to obtain a PBA card are not that high. You either lace them up and go or you don't enter. The onus is on you not the other bowler.
True. Ultimately the bowler entering the tournament where they know a Pro is also participating has to decide if they are up to the challenge. The Pro also needs to have some scruples as well and decide if it is an appropriate event in which to participate. Both parties have a certain level of responsibility in the matter.
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Re: PBA in local amateur events
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Old 03-31-2017, 06:56 PM
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Re: PBA in local amateur events

Quote:
Originally Posted by milorafferty View Post
Without a real PBA tour, these folks will continue to bottom feed off these tournaments.

I can't say I blame them, the PBA doesn't pay squat. Last year, E.J. Tackett was the leading money winner in the PBA with $168,290.

Source: https://www.pba.com/SeasonStats/TotalWinnings/93

I make more than that in my job. How many other "professional" sports can we say that about?

Hmm, EJ was the leading money winner the season after I gave him ball cleaner samples. And a few years ago Mika had a huge year after I gave him samples. LOL. Those guys don't need any help LOL. They were both super nice people to bowl with, and I'm looking forward to this year's pro am, always a fun time.
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Re: PBA in local amateur events
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Old 03-31-2017, 07:05 PM
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Re: PBA in local amateur events

Quote:
Originally Posted by roylay View Post
Hmm, EJ was the leading money winner the season after I gave him ball cleaner samples. And a few years ago Mika had a huge year after I gave him samples. LOL. Those guys don't need any help LOL. They were both super nice people to bowl with, and I'm looking forward to this year's pro am, always a fun time.
It has to be the shoes...err...ball cleaner!

Re: PBA in local amateur events
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Old 03-31-2017, 08:44 PM
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Re: PBA in local amateur events

If you're bowling scratch, may the best bowler win.

And if you're bowling handicap, that PBA member probably doesn't get any bonus sticks.

Re: PBA in local amateur events
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Old 04-01-2017, 01:26 PM
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Re: PBA in local amateur events

I just bowled a local tournament two sundays ago, and it had handicap, but I haven't bowled league in 7 years. So i didn't get handicap, I still bowled 220s, but I got 37th place because guys who bowl league with a 100 average, then they cash out in these tournaments because they get 67+ handicap. They didn't allow PBA card holders for a tournament. If you're bowling something where card holders are allowed, then be ready to bowl against those kinds of people. If you own a card, you can't do a lot of tournaments or sweepers. So if you got the talent need to bowl something to stay fresh.
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Re: PBA in local amateur events
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Old 04-02-2017, 11:34 AM
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Re: PBA in local amateur events

Look at the number of pba and wpba bowlers currently leading at the usbc Open Championships…..

Each tournament can have only one winner, and everyone else is hoping to cash something. 99.9% of the time the one making these post is not going to win no matter if it has a pba player or not.

Once you understand there's always someone out there that is going to bowl really well and be the front runner and everyone else is fighting just to be in the mix the better your chances of doing so.
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Re: PBA in local amateur events
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Old 04-04-2017, 01:07 PM
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Re: PBA in local amateur events

Quote:
Originally Posted by milorafferty View Post
It has to be the shoes...err...ball cleaner!
E.J. was a super nice guy to bowl with, and I really enjoyed watching him bowl. I'm hoping he shows up here again in May.
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Re: PBA in local amateur events
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Old 04-06-2017, 01:26 PM
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Re: PBA in local amateur events

Back on subject: We have at least 3 PBA card holders on our handicap league. They are all good bowlers but not the best on the league. One of them has rolled two 300 games this season. No one that I know of has a problem with bowling with them. I can certainly understand though when they're bowling on a big money league, ore even some tournaments.
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Re: PBA in local amateur events
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Old 04-06-2017, 02:36 PM
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Re: PBA in local amateur events

Quote:
Originally Posted by roylay View Post
Back on subject: We have at least 3 PBA card holders on our handicap league. They are all good bowlers but not the best on the league. One of them has rolled two 300 games this season. No one that I know of has a problem with bowling with them. I can certainly understand though when they're bowling on a big money league, ore even some tournaments.
There shouldn't really be any issue with PBA card holders on handicap leagues. The handicap alleviates a majority of the potential scoring discrepancies between the PBA member and a casual bowler. They have to be able to bowl somewhere on their downtime. There are a couple of PBA members on one of my handicap leagues, and no one cares. They have good weeks and bad weeks just like most people do (although their attitudes could be a little better at times.)
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Re: PBA in local amateur events
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Old 04-06-2017, 03:16 PM
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Re: PBA in local amateur events

I know of no PBA members who have titles who bottom feed. I've even run into a couple of National titleholders who have dropped by to watch friends bowl at local tournaments, and asked one of them if he was going to shoe up. His reply: not enough money to matter.

But even if they did decide to bowl, so what? It's all scratch, and I've beaten them in single games and series before. And as somebody else said, just because you have a card doesn't mean much.

You still have to bowl. You still have to deliver the most shots.

Re: PBA in local amateur events
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Old 04-06-2017, 07:22 PM
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Re: PBA in local amateur events

My little brother is a PBA member and bowls all the local tournaments. He's won several, but it's still a challenge to face some of the state/regions better bowlers. He hopes to win money to help pay for more tournaments, but it's mostly just to stay competitive and bowl in events that actually matter. Leagues just aren't that competitive where he lives.
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Re: PBA in local amateur events
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Old 05-20-2017, 01:08 AM
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Re: PBA in local amateur events

I have zero issue with anyone enter a tournament as long as the rules allow them to. You have guys like me holding a card but not a serious threat to the younger guys due to my age and health (I'm only keeping my card for the magazine). I enjoy going with the wife to tournaments and being able to bowl. There are several tournaments in our region that prohibit card holders from bowling. Why? Honestly the better guys don't have time for most of these tournaments anyway.
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